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BD faux pas(s)

Discussion in 'Debates' started by Misskin, Aug 15, 2015.

  1. Misskin

    Misskin http://www.furaffinity.net/user/misskin/

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    PREAMBLE: If any of the mod staff believes this threads creation is a mistake, will be too volatile, or just doesn't feel comfortable with letting it persist, please do delete it with my apologies.

    I know I can't possibly be the only one fascinated by the heated debates that crops up over on the main forums, whether it's discord over the Labs winner, heavy contention over a products backstory/character art, displeasure over the way a sale was ran, or unannounced price changes. It seems that with the BD consumers, almost no action they take doesn't result in some backlash or another. Lets discuss why
     
  2. Misskin

    Misskin http://www.furaffinity.net/user/misskin/

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    Okay, so we've all seen that Sugar Star hubbub, but I don't really want to talk about that specifically.
    I'm much more interested in one of the issues the release has brought up--> Some Kinks being more valid or acceptable than others.
    The BD philosophy appears to be about being inclusive and accepting of all people's fantasies, but some very vocal people are disputing that. The issue appears to be that only kinks that involves willing participants is deemed okay.

    Now this rule is the most morally sound, humane, and ethical, but kind of muddy when applied to some situations.
    So the question I ask now is how do we define "willing participants". Saying Yes can't really cut it (because underage and bestiality reasons), so what is a good definition?
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2015
  3. Robert Thompson

    Robert Thompson Reaper of Fallen Toys, Porn King

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    Consent is the biggest taboo for me. 'Yes' does not work. I can not communicate with an animal in a manner that would convey true intentions. And I feel that children do not have the mental capacity to understand sex and what ot means.
     
  4. Misskin

    Misskin http://www.furaffinity.net/user/misskin/

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    Your principles on this subject are what I think are held by the vast majority when applied to real world interaction, but does this hold for you in the fantasy realm? Are you alright with beast or underage in a purely literary, illustrated or adult toy situation (such as Crackers)
     
  5. Robert Thompson

    Robert Thompson Reaper of Fallen Toys, Porn King

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    I am a little more open in an illustration outlook one walk though my porn collection will show that. But in the open air as a purchase page it kind of is rocky
     
  6. Misskin

    Misskin http://www.furaffinity.net/user/misskin/

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    I can see why.
    I think the issue with people is that in their eyes buying something that has a taboo concept attached to it implies a sort of acceptance of said taboo.

    If X buys a toy marketed as a Shota Lover Companion, it is instantly implied that X is into underage boys whether its true or not. They could like the design or can't use regular size toys but the public will probably not accept these reasons.

    This all boils down to perceptions of peoples intentions
     
  7. Robert Thompson

    Robert Thompson Reaper of Fallen Toys, Porn King

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    Thank you. You said better than anyone else
    If a person finds a woman's dildo nothing. Person finds a man's dildo al kinds of questions start up.

    To purchase an item is to say one enjoys every aspect of said item. Including its lure.

    This is the issue with society. Move to conclusion minus all facts
     
  8. Vitani

    Vitani Tertiary antagonist

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    A willing participant - Someone of age, who can clearly, and coherently express desire for sexual interactions. If animal/beast, it needs to be anthropomorphized enough to be able to understand exactly what is going on, and what is being asked of them.

    That being said, I do have a sort of rape fetish, and I understand that I will probably get attacked for that.
    And by 'sort of' I mean...I am an extreme submissive, and I get off to fantasies of being forced into sexual situations by someone bigger or stronger than me. (So /technically/, it's not rape, cos I'm willing. :p)

    The stories or character art that is attached to BD toys rarely affects my purchasing choice, as I always make up my own stories and characters anyways. And I don't care about society, because the world doesn't need to know when I order a xenomorph dick off the internet.
     
  9. Robert Thompson

    Robert Thompson Reaper of Fallen Toys, Porn King

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    I do the same thing, about making up new stories for the toys. Why use someone else's fantasy
     
  10. Misskin

    Misskin http://www.furaffinity.net/user/misskin/

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    Imo it wouldn't really be right for anyone to attack you over wanting to be a recipient. Like how in the world could that be aaaaanyone's business but your own xD
     
  11. Vitani

    Vitani Tertiary antagonist

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    I actually have gotten ... 'Don't glamorize rape! It's not hot, sexy, or fun. Being a victim of rape is actually very terrifying you insensitive bitch'

    Like, I REALIZE that getting raped is nothing to take lightly, and I'm not...trying to glam it...I just...like...forced...situations...icanthelpit :c
     
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  12. SnowLycan

    SnowLycan ☆*:.。.Mahou shoujo.。.:*☆

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    Wait so me fantasising about being dominated by a big feral male means I am into rape fantasies.

    I thought I was just sexually frustrated.

    Oh dear I need to rethink my life.
     
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  13. GuyStripes

    GuyStripes An automatonic shark pirate

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    Sugar Star hubbub? I feel like I'm opening old wounds by asking about that. But, that's my style. So if anyone wants to metaphorically cut the stitches and wants to fill me in on that, I'd appreciate it.

    On the other subject. Fuck, I have so much to say that I don't even know where to begin.
     
  14. Vitani

    Vitani Tertiary antagonist

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    With the release of BD's latest toy, Sugar Star...a alot of people were put off and wildly offended that BD would base a toy so directly on a character that was based on a children's show (MLP), style and all. Calling it borderline pedophilia, and 'disgusting' because kids might find it when they search google or w/e.

    That's the jist of it anyways. I don't frequent the old forums much.
     
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  15. Icestar

    Icestar Transformers!

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    ^basically it. i'm going to make a lot of words.

    some people have worded it really well. i am too on the side of being put off by BD. when it comes to sexual things, i am completely terrified of horses and ponies. and i love horses. i have a collection of 20 Breyer's horses (and a wolf and cougar of their making as well), and i love them, i've collected since i was a kid, and i still kind of want a horse. the exact reason i am terrified of horses/ponies sexually is because of bronies and now i can only withstand so much talk of MLP even casually. so you can see why this has hit a bad vibe.

    Chance and Mary still held the same reaction because they're horses. but i could hold up a little better, as they were kinda just that. with this Sugar Star, it's /obviously/ MLP and, as others have said, a cash grab at bronies.

    as another user has said it, it's that their ages while not disclosed is likely under. they are at a point they're old enough to not be totally dependent on their parents (as in not stay at home 24/7 like a child child) but not too old to be out of 'school'. they still have the a-moral-a-day kinda thing- which points that they're still /young/ and learning generally-basic topics. they are in the demographic of grade schoolers, and the easiest way to get them to relate is set in the same age group. so you can kinda see where this argument has a point.

    in my personal opinion, BD could have done a lot better with Sugar Star. mostly it is the art (to me, her stuff just looks like... it was slapped on. i mean, does a vulva really stick off like that?). everyone kinda knows that Nox is a bit of a point at a Night Fury- but his art (while similar) is not immediately recognizable. a different color, has horns, spikes are different, no fins behind the wings, can't see if he's got a tailtip fin, i believe the wings are different too. i have a Nox in Night Drake and didn't really make that connection till after i got it. now when you look at Sugar Star, BANG. that's MLP, no doubts and instantly recognizable to people who even passively know the show (ie; have kids that watch it in the mornings before school). also on the topic of the art; it is also said that Sugar Star does not look 'adult'. taking from the artistic standpoint, there's an easy difference to child drawings to adults: children are drawn with mostly curves and rounded areas whereas adults are more straight lines and harsher angles, also longer limbs in relation to body size. baby anything has a larger head proportionally to its adult form. it's stated that SS has no connection to MLP however the art is style and all MLP hands down, so likely exists in the same place as the show.

    people argue back in saying other shows that aren't so taboo to be into 'the' fandom; I'm going to use Transformers and HTTYD for this. both shows have demographics that are aimed at both kids and adults. this is easily told; Transformers is VERY complicated at times, and does have a lot of underlying subplot that children miss (you know kid's shows that had innuendos you totally missed when you were young?) while adults will catch, but the story while intense (the last movie, one of the first things was Ratchet being killed!) is easy enough for younger at face, and the action is incredible. plus, all the characters are adults (the Cybertronians are all millions of years old across all movies! *nerd moment*). for HTTYD; the characters are teens and now (as of HTTYD2) adults, likely in their 20's at this point. it's a short connection that Toothless as well is probably about the same age. in addition we have the movie plot; dragon's arent as bad as everyone thought, and in the second they need to save the dragons from Drago. but we also have Hiccup and Astrid's relationship, which kids really see a sappy love thing and don't pay much attention to it. we also have Stoic and Valka reunited, which kids see a happy thing but still don't see it as much as adults do. and also we have Stoic's death shortly after his reuniting with Valka. we also have the death of Valka's Bewilderbeast, then the completely charged scene of Drago's Bewilderbeast being defeated. again, it's action that intense but kids can follow and adults can enjoy.

    TL;DR
    BD could have done a lot better, and a lot better is mostly just getting different art for Sugar Star that wasn't so obviously MLP. people might not be in such a tizzy if, perhaps, she looked like she existed in the same world as Tucker and Chance.

    also the backgrounds have put people off because it looks childish, which i agree and i've adbocked the two images. it's also said that the rotating backgrounds have been murdering mobile users' phones/etc., and for laptop people (like me) it make their computer auto change its brightness (as it rotates between 'light' and 'dark' images).


    TOTALLY NOT ON THE TOPIC I WROTE A TON FOR

    BD has lagged with toy drops but they've caught up a little and seem to have released a bunch of flops. also they are now going ot send lube sample packs with every order evidently, wonder how much is in them.

    don't take mt saying BD as the entire company. i'm sure that the person who is simply pouring isn't to any blame. i commend their jobs, actually! but it's those in high power who haven't been thinking better (did they not think they'd get a ton of backlash for using that image for SS? (the artist did *okay*)).

    though i do commend their customer service as well; they do a good job of being timely with their tickets and being fair with fixes. i had a lube bottle leak in my last order so they sent a new one free of charge.

    also just a nitpick: Chance. two parts; one, his head. like, above the shoulders. it looks like a totally different art style from the body. like its a cutout or something! also with his other head... if you look between the flared and unflared you can see that the head just had the bubble tool used on it, and actually doesn't look like a flared head at all.

    however until BD kinda fesses up or gets into better favor, i might be getting the toy i've wanted for my boyfriend (an anthro shark, Lily, or 'ess muzzle (in colors like Icestar on the last two) off secondhand and cleaning it REALLY good than i'd want to order from them. maybe a flop. maybe.
     
  16. Willow

    Willow Slut and proud!

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    Actually this is not going be directly about the toy(s) but the reactions. And why they are the way they are.
    In the past year I see so many criticisms on... well, everything. Or nearly everything. Some people bitched about the googly-eyes promotoion. I mean, what the fuck? Come on. I know is was because the release of a kid's movie, but they weren't really tying to that. And other bitching about... well, I can't remember... I kinda avoid that as much as I can.
    But the question is... why the fuss? Or why are they doing this to every single promotion or release?

    I believe the shift in they way the handled things. Like the sudden pull of Chance. The shutdown of the forums. The way the handled people who were very vocal about the shutdown. The rare occurance of bad customer service (usually rectified... but still can leave a bad taste). As say they... takes years to build a reputation... seconds to destroy it. And that's what may have happened here. There were many instances were they could have listened to us. We may not be the majority of their business, but we are usually the most loyal... and we can carry a lot of weight... more than they may realize.
    There will always be some kind of backlash but now it's be multiplied 5 fold because of how we now perceive them. Not everyone is affected by this, but it had an impact on some people. And then those people raise a fuss, more people have to respond and it snowballs from there.
    As for Sugar Star, do I think it would have gotten backlash if we didn't have this tarnished view on BD? Yes, we still would have gotten one. Do I think it would have been as bad as it was. No, it would've been less. I remember the release of Snowball and there were a few people who were a little icked out by how young he lookced. But that was barely a blip on the radar.

    That's why I think things are this way now.
     
  17. MurphyAlter

    MurphyAlter The Floofiest

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    I think it comes down to this:

    *BD makes a toy themed after a franchise*
    "HOLY SHIT WTF, CHILDHOOD RUINED BY THESE FUCKING CASHGRABBERS!"

    *BD makes a toy not themed after a franchise*
    "I don't get it..."

    *BD makes a toy based after a commonly modeled animal*
    "FUCKING DESIGN THIEVES!"

    *BD makes a toy after an animal not modeled before ever by anybody*
    "I don't get it..."

    *BD makes a toy based on a canine*
    "JESUS FUCK, ANOTHER FUCKING CANINE?"

    *BD makes a toy based on anything else*
    "WTF, I voted for the canine!"

    *BD has a sale*
    "They're just trying to get rid of shit that nobody wants!"

    *BD doesn't have a sale*
    "God, it's so fucking expensive, they just want money!"

    *BD makes a theme color*
    "CASH GRUBBING WHOREBAGS! YOU'RE RUINING MY CHILDHOOD AGAIN"

    *BD makes a special color scheme not actually based on anything*
    "YOU CAN'T DO THAT! ALL THOSE OTHER TOY MAKERS MAKE IN THAT COLOR YOU FUCKING COPYCAT BASTARDS!"


    Basically, they really can't do anything right anymore, because there will always be people looking to fault them. Not to say they're always right, but remember this list the next time there's any kind of hubbub.
     
  18. Vitani

    Vitani Tertiary antagonist

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    I can't agree with your post more.
    I love BD. I love their quality, I love their designs, and I love the detail that each toy has.

    But the customer service, and PR is complete crap. It still isn't much better than when it all blew up, so many things are changed without notice, there are s many 'exceptions' to rules, and really nothing is clarified outright at all. That's probably the main reason that I have not done any business with them for a few years now. I now buy my toys secondhand. Not to mention that horrible Duke the Bad Dragon Twitter account ...

    I lost pretty much all respect when all that shit went down, and yeah, it's going to take something preeeetty fucking impressive for them to get that back. And I'd put money on it that I'm not the only one who feels this way.
     
  19. Poster Nutbag

    Poster Nutbag Prefers the company of snakes over bees

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    I think the biggest blunder with Sugar Star was that they got Braeburned (Who draws 99% gay clop) to design the character, then release a male character with art from a different artist shortly after.


    Pretty much this... People like to bitch mindlessly at trivial things. BD definitely isnt perfect, but some of the stuff people not only complain, but get outraged about is simply silly.
     

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