Gender Identity and Orientation (casual talk)

Yeah, I think the people you talked to are definitely the kind that just haven't been educated on the matter, and that's where the issue comes from. Not trying to justify that sort of thinking, it does need to change for certain. I wasn't sure if you were addressing everyone though or just part of society.

And I wouldn't classify myself as being in a relationship with biological offspring as the "primary intention". My primary intention is to be in a healthy loving relationship. But it's my life intention to get pregnant and raise a family. I don't see how that would be creepy.

 

I didn't mean that casually discussing or wanting biological children in general is creepy, I meant more when people talk about someone specific who doesn't know them well or at all having their children, before even developing a relationship.

 

You mean like the joke of "I'd like to have his babies" or flipped? I dunno, I don't think it's creepy.
But I will say that in my current relationship, I discussed whether or not he was willing to have children way before we ever got serious, or even official.

 

Huh. I can say that's actually the first time I've ever heard of that happening.

 

I am turned off by transgender people, but I wouldn't call myself narrow minded :C
I mean, I don't fully understand their POV, but I have friends who are trans who I love to death, but when it comes to potential relationships or fuck buddies...Uh, no thanks. It's just not attractive to me.

 

You're allowed to only be attracted to certain people. Those that act like only being attracted to a specific gender or body type is some sort of "hate" need to go fuck a sea urchin. What? You don't want to? You fucking anti-sea-urchinist, you make me sick.

 

@Vitani I wouldn't call you narrow minded either!
Personally, I was more referencing people who do not want to be with a trans person because it would "make them gay". If you're not attracted to something, you're not attracted to it and that's just the way it is.

 

Yeah. As much as trans people would love to have the real deal in their pants, they unfortunately don't. And it sucks. But most of us understand that if someone is attracted to cis-gendered-genitals and only wants to be with someone who has that quality, well, that's just their cup of tea. You're fine as long as you turn someone down gently and politely and don't say something like, "Wow, you're trans? That's disgusting. And your body disgusts me, too." Because saying shit like that, or making it apparent that you feel that way, really hurts. Every trans person I've met hates being trans. I would never wish it on anyone to feel the way I do about myself. So when people say things like that it just makes us feel even more like we'll never be seen the way we want to be by others. It sucks. So. Fucking. Much.
I'm waiting for the day they can use stem cells to 3D print me a fully functional dick with all the hookups. xD

 

*Deep breath, first post on Bad Dragon Chat*

I'm scared that I suffer from "special snowflake syndrome", but I personally like the finely-graded labels. It seems to give everyone a chance to discuss what their identity and orientation means to them, and accept all the ways we can be different. It gave me great comfort to see the subtle shadings between hetero and bi, and realize that just because I'm much more attracted to men doesn't mean that I don't like women too. The "demisexual" term was the biggest eyeopener of all, and it's much easier to talk about it with other people when I know what to call it. Confining oneself to a label is a bad idea, but just finding a label that suits your current status? I like it. It's like a confirmation that I belong, that there are enough people out there like me that we've got a name.

As for bi- vs. pan-, I interpreted it literally, figuring that bi means being attracted to men and women, but not ambiguously-gendered, asexual, or thoroughly inhuman characters, whereas pan would include all of those. *shrug* I'd have to call myself bi in that case: I like stereotypically "masculine"-bodied men and "feminine"-bodied women. I can absolutely appreciate someone's personality outside of those guidelines, but I wouldn't be sexually attracted to them. I'd LIKE to be able to be attracted to more types, and if, say, my husband decided to have a sex change, I certainly wouldn't be going anywhere, but...my brain says "person" not "sex interest" (not that they're mutually exclusive, but you get what I'm saying ).

I've only ever known one trans person, a friend of my aunt. But she was older than me and I never really knew her very well, so I never felt like I could say anything to her, but thinking back, sometimes I wish I had. I heard through the grapevine that she was really nervous about attending my bridal shower--a big gathering of cis women--but she did, and I don't think anyone "suspected" a thing. (Not that it should have mattered, but the world sucks right now.) I was so proud of her, wish I had hugged her or something and told her that. It's funny: before I met her, I thought it was going to be weird, but somehow...it just wasn't. She was really tall, square jaw, but it seemed perfectly natural to think of her as another woman.

 

I'd agree with everything there, especially one point, about how the concept of being demisexual was an eye-opener. The best thing about incorporating these terms into my vocabulary has certainly been how it's changed the way I interact with people, changed my assumptions about strangers, and made me excited to meet people who identify as anything beyond the big three. I was so giddy when I met my latest trans friend, I wore a rainbow scarf and sat next to her every day, and always encouraged her to talk to our philosophy class about her transition when we talked about relevant subjects (identity, enlightenment, etc) and she would run her ideas by me before shooting up her hand.

 

I agree with Caracal. I like the multitudes of labels. For some people maybe having a label isn't important because they're able to accept themselves the way they are and that's absolutely fantastic. But other people have lots of problems because they feel entirely isolated and alone and worry that they're a freak, so finding a label for their feelings and a group of other people that identify under it like them is a revelation to them.

That's what it was like for me. I'm a genderfluid person, meaning that my identity flows through multiple different identities. Like sometimes I'm a girl and I'm happy in my female body, and sometimes I'm a boy and hate my body and my hair and everything and then sometimes I'm like fuck this binary bullshit and chill somewhere in the middle or off the spectrum entirely. One of my best friends is a trans dude and previous to finding out about non-binary identities and specifically genderfluid I felt super isolated and freakish because sometimes I really empathized with the dysphoria he felt/feels and sometimes I was like I am woman hear me roar! And I felt awful because I was like "why can't I just be normal and make up my mind!". And I think lots of people other than me have had that experience. And if there weren't umpteen labels and identities I never would have found out that other people feel like me and that I'm not just some freak with a problem.

I also feel uncomfortable with the male/female question at the doctor's office. Because like my trans friend, what box should he check? he's not a female, and he's on hormones but neither was he born biologically male. He doesn't have a box that works for him. I really think they need to have male/female and other with a descriptor so you can say you're in transition and then in addition to that they need to have a place to put your pronouns so they can use your correct pronouns.

 

Definitely. I doubt there is a single person here who would disagree with that.

 

I'd agree with the whole third box for "Other" on a doctor's note, but I don't agree with the whole pronouns things. I just see that as a way to get attention.

My stance on that is what the person identifies most with. Do you identify yourself more towards being masculine? Then you're a he, him, his, whatever. Same if you identify more as feminine, she, her, hers. None of this hir or shim. None of this special snowflake crap. All it does is complicate a simple thing. I'm not going to take the time to learn someone's "preferred pronouns", nor apologize if I get it wrong. I will address you as I see you.

Then again, I'm against labels anyway. So I'm just blowing smoke in this topic. Ignore me, carry on.

 

Its nice to see society progressing to be a bit more accepting of transgendered and others.

Here's a personal expirence with a transgender man. He is transitioning from female to male, and is one of my favorite Tumblr blog artists. He is in fact going to Ciderfest this year, and I have so much excitement to meet him.

Anyhow, there was this little music PMV he was working on back in the day. He voices acts too for his characters, but again as he was born female, he can only voice act female characters, and really hates that. He'd rather voice act as the Doctor (he runs the Discorded Doctor blog). So he's drawing for the Pmv, and a song he and some friends had recorded for the pmv was playing. It's basically a parody of "Be Prepared". I figures he was he female voice in the song, but at many points during the song, the voice clashes with the music. I have a very keen ear for that sort of thing. So I comment on the chat for the Live stream "No offense to the voice actor, but the female singer sounds a little off in this song", or something along those lines to that. I wasn't trying to sound mean, I thought I was giving constructive criticism. And the other fans just go off on me, and said artist simply states he is very self conscious of his voice and that he himself really hated it. I just apologized, as I felt kind of awkward and everyone was just bashing me.

So yeah, I guess my lesson for you guys is try to be aware of someone's peeves. Even if you think its ridiculous, just be respectful, especially if the person is someone you admire.

 

Still, if you didn't know, they had no reason to jump down your throat. It might be an unpopular opinion, but I'm going to say if you're self-conscious about a skill or trait you don't have, or can't perform as well as you'd like, getting mild criticism ought to be expected.

To put it in perspective, I know I'm not that great of an artist, but when I do art, I expect some amount of criticism, especially if it's on an aspect I KNOW I'm bad with, or haven't had sufficient practice on.

 

I sometimes wonder if gender-specific pronouns have a subconscious effect on how we view gender, sort of like how forcibly smiling can start to make you feel happy. Use of he/she means that before you can even talk about someone, you have to decide if they're male or female. I mean, think about that: unless you use unconventional words or use plural pronouns "incorrectly", just constructing a sentence about someone requires you to specify a binary gender. It's easier to omit species than it is gender. We can know that personality is more important than anything, and know that gender isn't binary, yet to even speak normally, we have to refer to archaic terminology, and we do so perpetually throughout every day of our lives. We're all raised with "he/she" being a normal, harmless convention, but I wonder if it has more effect than we realize.

*rereads own post* Holy awkward grammar, Batman.